Discussion:
Costs of research
(too old to reply)
Peter
2019-04-19 10:30:04 UTC
Permalink
I am attempting to research my grand-father's family of wife and seven
children, all of whom are dead.
I am a newcome to family research.

The cost of proving date of birth is that of £11 for a birth
certificate.
Is there any way of reducing or avoiding this fee? The arithmetic with
seven children is simple, but beyond my pocket.

Petefj
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2019-04-19 11:54:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter
I am attempting to research my grand-father's family of wife and seven
children,
(Not Von Trapp by any chance?)
Post by Peter
all of whom are dead.
I am a newcome to family research.
Welcome to the hobby! (Lifestyle ...)
Post by Peter
The cost of proving date of birth is that of £11 for a birth
certificate.
Is there any way of reducing or avoiding this fee? The arithmetic with
seven children is simple, but beyond my pocket.
Petefj
Depends what you want to "prove". For legal purposes, you _do_ need the
piece of paper; most of us here aren't interested in proof to that
extent. Working downwards in cost: firstly, I _think_ the GRO are still
doing their .pdf-by-email exercise, where they will email you a scan of
a certificate - not valid for legal purposes, but fine for genealogy. It
still costs, I'm not sure how much: search at
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/indexes_search.asp (you
have to register, but that's free), which will get you to the nearest
quarter year. (Irritatingly - to me, anyway - they refer to the quarters
by the final month, e. g. 1960 J quarter [June]; I find this irritating
because [a] not everybody uses the same month [so that could be
January], (b) once that's been copied a time or two someone will forget
it means quarter and think that the month is known. I prefer to say
1960Q2.) Most of the same information can be found more easily at
https://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl - IIRR you don't have to
register, or give the gender, and you're not restricted to a five-year
span (nominal ± 2 years), and the search facility is more comprehensive.
The GRO one does give mother's maiden name - though for your
grandfather's children (I presume born after 191x), the FreeBMD one will
too.

So it comes down to what information you want. The GRO and FreeBMD
indexes will give you the quarter, name (of child), mother's maiden
surname, and registration _district_; if you want exact date, exact
place, and a few other details, you'd need the certificate.

If they were baptised, which is less common as the 20th century goes on,
you might find baptism records - if you know where they were baptised;
there are _not_ usually kept in the church, but the local county record
office. These are usually "free" to access, but expect to pay car
parking charges, and for any hard copies you want (last time I used one
it was a pound for a print from the streaky microfilms, or 2.50 for a
colour picture of the original document. These were from older
documents; I don't know if 20th-century stuff is different, though I
can't see why it should be). Baptism records show when baptised, and
parents' names and abode (usually just one word of abode), and
(father's) occupation; it's pot luck, the person making the entry may
also note when the child was born. In my experience, they've done that a
bit less than half the time, as a note in the left margin.

If you _know_ any of the seven children, or their descendants, _ask_
them; they may well have old birth certificates and other documents, and
be willing to give you scans (best), photographs, or even the originals.
As well as photographs.

Why are you doing this - just curiosity, intending to write a book, or
just as part of getting into genealogy?

Best of luck, John
--


(Where has the "treat northern Ireland differently" option gone?)

Three- (or four-) way referendum, if we _have_ to have another one.
--
Petitions are still unfair.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/232770 255soft.uk #fairpetitions
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Anybody who thinks there can be unlimited growth in a static, limited
environment, is either mad or an economist. - Sir David Attenborough, in
Radio Times 10-16 November 2012
Peter
2019-04-21 06:12:26 UTC
Permalink
snipped
Why are you doing this - just curiosity, intending to write a book, or
just as part of getting into genealogy?
Just starting into genealogy. And very confusing it is too.
Thank you for the information.
Petefj
Best of luck, John
MB
2019-04-21 07:54:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter
Just starting into genealogy. And very confusing it is too.
Thank you for the information.
Petefj
Find someone with an interest in the subject and an Ancestry or FMP
account, possibly in the local FHS.

It can be surprising how much you can find sometimes in quite a short
time.
Keith Nuttle
2019-04-21 09:50:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by MB
Just starting into genealogy.  And very confusing it is too.
Thank you for the information.
Petefj
Find someone with an interest in the subject and an Ancestry or FMP
account, possibly in the local FHS.
It can be surprising how much you can find sometimes in quite a short time.
I am in the US. Our library are mostly free, but I am 700 miles of
where my ancestors lived. However using the resources on the internet I
have been able to lean a lot about my families for about 7 generations
from the online document images.

While some people complain about the cost of Ancestry, the subscription
works out to about $20 US/week. That does not go very far toward the
cost of the gasoline to get to the archives that contain the information
you need. We are also very lucky in the US to have the extensive
online records that the Mormon's maintain which is free to all.

Many of our local Genealogy and History Societies also have very good
collections of document images. Usually membership to these societies
for full access to their records is nominal.

Fortunately/Unfortunately most of us in the US are only able to push our
families back into the early 1700's so we do not have the rarer
documents that are available in Europe. I can only imagine living in
an area where the histories go back a thousand years or more.
--
2018: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2019-04-21 14:37:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keith Nuttle
Post by MB
Just starting into genealogy.  And very confusing it is too.
Thank you for the information.
Petefj
Find someone with an interest in the subject and an Ancestry or FMP
account, possibly in the local FHS.
It can be surprising how much you can find sometimes in quite a short time.
Indeed; these days, especially with access to an Ancestry or FMP account
(but even with just FreeBMD and the GRO if you don't hit any walls), you
can get a fair-sized tree in a short time. (For UK folk, that is.)
Post by Keith Nuttle
I am in the US. Our library are mostly free, but I am 700 miles of
As are ours, and most have Ancestry or FMP.
Post by Keith Nuttle
where my ancestors lived. However using the resources on the internet
I have been able to lean a lot about my families for about 7
generations from the online document images.
While some people complain about the cost of Ancestry, the subscription
works out to about $20 US/week. That does not go very far toward the
It sounds a lot when you put it like that!
Post by Keith Nuttle
cost of the gasoline to get to the archives that contain the
Indeed, I would very rarely even consider going to an archive where the
records were on Ancestry. (OK, distances are shorter here, but fuel is
about 1.30 pounds a *litre* ...) Archives have more comprehensive and
further-back records than Ancestry and FMP, though.
Post by Keith Nuttle
information you need. We are also very lucky in the US to have the
extensive online records that the Mormon's maintain which is free to
all.
We have access to them here too - and they cover quite a lot of here
too. (I recommend their "Durham Diocese Bishop's Transcripts" - sadly
_not_ *indexed*, but divided into parishes and within those into time
blocks, and cover _lots_ of Northumberland, Durham, Cumberland, and
Yorkshire.)
[]
Post by Keith Nuttle
Fortunately/Unfortunately most of us in the US are only able to push
our families back into the early 1700's so we do not have the rarer
documents that are available in Europe. I can only imagine living in
an area where the histories go back a thousand years or more.
Me too (-:. Online, we can mostly only get to early 1700s, or late 16xx,
too; visiting archives _if_ they have the parish records will in most
cases only get you to 15xx, and then only if you can be sure you're
following the right line (the information in the typical parish record
before printed forms is usually pretty minimal, and not enough to be
sure you've got the right person). The only records that go back a
_long_ way tend to be ones for aristocratic families and royalty - and
some of _those_ are fanciful rather than accurate.
So it isn't a "golden area" of easy ancient records!
(I'm talking England/Scotland/Wales [Ireland - big fire in Dublin castle
in the 1920s lost a lot - odd copies keep turning up from around
Ireland]. Rest of Europe I know little of - though people I've spoken to
say German records are good, despite what one might expect due to wars.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

After all is said and done, usually more is said.
Keith Nuttle
2019-04-21 18:32:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Just starting into genealogy.  And very confusing it is too.
Thank you for the information.
Petefj
 Find someone with an interest in the subject and an Ancestry or FMP
account, possibly in the local FHS.
 It can be surprising how much you can find sometimes in quite a
short time.
Indeed; these days, especially with access to an Ancestry or FMP account
(but even with just FreeBMD and the GRO if you don't hit any walls), you
can get a fair-sized tree in a short time. (For UK folk, that is.)
I am in the US.  Our library are mostly free, but I am 700 miles of
As are ours, and most have Ancestry or FMP.
where my ancestors lived.  However using the resources on the internet
I have been able to lean a lot about my families for about 7
generations from the online document images.
While some people complain about the cost of Ancestry, the
subscription works out to about $20 US/week.  That does not go very
far toward the
It sounds a lot when you put it like that!
cost of the gasoline to get to the archives that contain the
Indeed, I would very rarely even consider going to an archive where the
records were on Ancestry. (OK, distances are shorter here, but fuel is
about 1.30 pounds a *litre* ...) Archives have more comprehensive and
further-back records than Ancestry and FMP, though.
information you need.   We are also very lucky in the US to have the
extensive online records that the Mormon's maintain which is free to all.
We have access to them here too - and they cover quite a lot of here
too. (I recommend their "Durham Diocese Bishop's Transcripts" - sadly
_not_ *indexed*, but divided into parishes and within those into time
blocks, and cover _lots_ of Northumberland, Durham, Cumberland, and
Yorkshire.)
[]
Fortunately/Unfortunately most of us in the US are only able to push
our families back into the early 1700's so we do not have the rarer
documents that are available in Europe.   I can only imagine living in
an area where the histories go back a thousand years or more.
Me too (-:. Online, we can mostly only get to early 1700s, or late 16xx,
too; visiting archives _if_ they have the parish records will in most
cases only get you to 15xx, and then only if you can be sure you're
following the right line (the information in the typical parish record
before printed forms is usually pretty minimal, and not enough to be
sure you've got the right person). The only records that go back a
_long_ way tend to be ones for aristocratic families and royalty - and
some of _those_ are fanciful rather than accurate.
So it isn't a "golden area" of easy ancient records!
(I'm talking England/Scotland/Wales [Ireland - big fire in Dublin castle
in the 1920s lost a lot - odd copies keep turning up from around
Ireland]. Rest of Europe I know little of - though people I've spoken to
say German records are good, despite what one might expect due to wars.)
The price of gasoline is going up in the US. Several months ago it was
about $2.00/gallon US, Today it is about $2.60/gallon US. I live about
10 miles from the nearest small town, and about 20 miles from the
nearest large town. There is no public transpiration so it does not take
many trips by car to ""town" to go through $20
--
2018: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre
Tickettyboo
2019-04-22 09:44:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
We have access to them here too - and they cover quite a lot of here
too. (I recommend their "Durham Diocese Bishop's Transcripts" - sadly
_not_ *indexed*, but divided into parishes and within those into time
blocks, and cover _lots_ of Northumberland, Durham, Cumberland, and
Yorkshire.)
FMP now have a searchable database linked to the images. Even without
an account searching is free and gives enough information (child's nme,
names of parents, baptism year and place) to make it a lot easier to
then find the free image on FS.
--
Tickettyboo
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2019-04-23 02:00:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tickettyboo
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
We have access to them here too - and they cover quite a lot of here
too. (I recommend their "Durham Diocese Bishop's Transcripts" - sadly
_not_ *indexed*, but divided into parishes and within those into time
blocks, and cover _lots_ of Northumberland, Durham, Cumberland, and
Yorkshire.)
FMP now have a searchable database linked to the images. Even without
an account searching is free and gives enough information (child's nme,
names of parents, baptism year and place) to make it a lot easier to
then find the free image on FS.
You mean FMP have indexed the FS Durham Diocese records? That's good to
know! (I have an FMP account, but keeping up with what the two main
companies - let alone other bodies - have added is quite a task. [The
LostCousins newsletter's often good at reporting new record sets that
have become available.])
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

[What's your guilty pleasure?] Why should you feel guilty about pleasure? -
Michel Roux Jr in Radio Times 2-8 February 2013
Richard Smith
2019-04-21 14:49:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keith Nuttle
While some people complain about the cost of Ancestry, the subscription
works out to about $20 US/week.
I assume that's a typo, or is membership in the US really that
expensive? I pay £180 p.a. for a "Worldwide" tier membership, which is
one of the more expensive types. In US dollars, that's about $4.50 a
week. I consider that fairly good value for the amount of use I get
from it.

Richard
Keith Nuttle
2019-04-21 18:38:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Richard Smith
Post by Keith Nuttle
While some people complain about the cost of Ancestry, the subscription
works out to about $20 US/week.
I assume that's a typo, or is membership in the US really that
expensive?  I pay £180 p.a. for a "Worldwide" tier membership, which is
one of the more expensive types.  In US dollars, that's about $4.50 a
week.  I consider that fairly good value for the amount of use I get
from it.
Richard
It should have been month. I have what they call the US Discovery
Membership (US states only) and it is $189/yr. The all World access is
$299/yr and the all records $389/yr
--
2018: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre
Richard van Schaik
2019-04-21 20:22:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keith Nuttle
It should have been month. I have what they call the US Discovery
Membership (US states only) and it is $189/yr.   The all World access is
$299/yr and the all records $389/yr
Do they have records from another World?
--
Richard van Schaik
***@THISgmail.com
http://www.fmavanschaik.nl/
The world is one big madhouse and this is main office.
Keith Nuttle
2019-04-21 23:30:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Richard van Schaik
Post by Keith Nuttle
It should have been month. I have what they call the US Discovery
Membership (US states only) and it is $189/yr.   The all World access
is $299/yr and the all records $389/yr
Do they have records from another World?
I have not checked, so far all of my docuemented connection and DNA
matches have been in the US and in Europe. ;-)
--
2018: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre
Richard Smith
2019-04-22 07:21:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Keith Nuttle
Post by Richard van Schaik
Post by Keith Nuttle
It should have been month. I have what they call the US Discovery
Membership (US states only) and it is $189/yr.   The all World access
is $299/yr and the all records $389/yr
Do they have records from another World?
I have not checked, so far all of my docuemented connection and DNA
matches have been in the US and in Europe. ;-)
As I understand it, the "all records" tier above Worldwide (which is
marketed as All Access in the UK) contains access to content on some
sites outside the main Ancestry brand, particularly local newspapers
from newspapers.com and additional military records on fold3.com. All
Access would cost me £205 (about US$270) a year, which is a fair bit
cheaper than the $389/yr Keith sees. Presumably either their pricing
model for Britain is different to the US or I've gained some sort of
discount over the years.

Richard
Tickettyboo
2019-04-24 20:16:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Richard Smith
Post by Keith Nuttle
While some people complain about the cost of Ancestry, the subscription
works out to about $20 US/week.
I assume that's a typo, or is membership in the US really that
expensive? I pay £180 p.a. for a "Worldwide" tier membership, which is
one of the more expensive types. In US dollars, that's about $4.50 a
week. I consider that fairly good value for the amount of use I get
from it.
Richard
£180 pa? That's way over the top :-)

I have full access to everything they have (with the exception of the
fold 3 military stuff, but there is little they have that (for me)
warrants the extra) and in Nov last year I paid £89.99 for a years full
access.
I did change my user name and email address so I would be a 'new
customer' and took advantage of a special offer link the young man I
spoke to about renewal, denied existed when I enquired why a
longstanding customer was expected to pay twice the price of a new
customer. It did exist, I used it when I finally lost patience with
him.

I don't mind changing my user name and email now and then (once a year)
as I don't have a tree on there and don't store any records. I have a
computer with ample storage. I only want access to the records and the
facility to save them to my computer.

and I have saved about half the advertised sub each year for the 15
years or so I have had an account with them.
--
Tickettyboo
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2019-04-21 14:44:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter
snipped
Why are you doing this - just curiosity, intending to write a book, or
just as part of getting into genealogy?
Just starting into genealogy. And very confusing it is too.
Thank you for the information.
Petefj
Best of luck, John
What's your email address? I just wrote you a long email, but it
bounced. (Mine is valid.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

I'm too lazy to have a bigger ego. - James May, RT 2016/1/23-29
Jenny M Benson
2019-04-21 15:30:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
What's your email address? I just wrote you a long email, but it
bounced. (Mine is valid.)
Did you notice what I assume is an extra m at the end of .com?
--
Jenny M Benson
http://jennygenes.blogspot.co.uk/
Peter
2019-04-22 06:53:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Post by Peter
snipped
Why are you doing this - just curiosity, intending to write a book, or
just as part of getting into genealogy?
Just starting into genealogy. And very confusing it is too.
Thank you for the information.
Petefj
Best of luck, John
What's your email address? I just wrote you a long email, but it
bounced. (Mine is valid.)
Sorry about that. email me at peterATpfjamesDOT.coDOT.uk
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2019-04-23 01:56:17 UTC
Permalink
[]
Post by Peter
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
What's your email address? I just wrote you a long email, but it
bounced. (Mine is valid.)
Sorry about that. email me at peterATpfjamesDOT.coDOT.uk
Done. [I assumed "DOT." didn't mean a double dot (-:]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

[What's your guilty pleasure?] Why should you feel guilty about pleasure? -
Michel Roux Jr in Radio Times 2-8 February 2013
Tim Powys-Lybbe
2019-04-19 14:22:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter
I am attempting to research my grand-father's family of wife and seven
children, all of whom are dead.
I am a newcome to family research.
The cost of proving date of birth is that of £11 for a birth
certificate.
Is there any way of reducing or avoiding this fee? The arithmetic with
seven children is simple, but beyond my pocket.
Petefj
My rule of thumb for such cousin searches is only to buy a certificate
when I need it to eliminate one or more of people with the same name.
Until I find a problem, I use the registration index entries as
sufficient evidence.

And the 1939 Register has exact birth dates so is very useful confirming
info if you can find your cousins on it. Electoral rolls also help to
confirm a family if the children stay at home once they have reached
voting age.
--
Tim Powys-Lybbe ***@powys.org
for a miscellany of bygones: http://powys.org/
Jenny M Benson
2019-04-19 14:35:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tim Powys-Lybbe
And the 1939 Register has exact birth dates so is very useful confirming
info if you can find your cousins on it.  Electoral rolls also help to
confirm a family if the children stay at home once they have reached
voting age.
Exact, but not always totally accurate! On several occasions I have
found the year to be a little out, though the day and month are usually
right and the correct year can be verified from the GRO Index.

Depending on the period of interest to the OP, it may be helpful that
date of birth is given in the Death Index from June Q 1969 onwards.
Again, might not be strictly accurate.
--
Jenny M Benson
http://jennygenes.blogspot.co.uk/
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2019-04-19 15:52:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jenny M Benson
Post by Tim Powys-Lybbe
And the 1939 Register has exact birth dates so is very useful
confirming info if you can find your cousins on it.  Electoral rolls
also help to confirm a family if the children stay at home once they
have reached voting age.
Exact, but not always totally accurate! On several occasions I have
found the year to be a little out, though the day and month are usually
right and the correct year can be verified from the GRO Index.
+1! I can only assume the questionnaire asked for age rather than date,
or something like that; it's often out by 1 year (with, as you say, day
and month being correct).

Peter said he's a newcomer to the hobby though, so may not have joined
anything that gives him access to the 1939 yet. (Plus, of course, as he
says it's his grandfather's children he's looking for [for now at
least!], 1939 _may_ be too far back. Peter, if you're still with us - do
you know his marriage date? [FreeBMD should help there.])
Post by Jenny M Benson
Depending on the period of interest to the OP, it may be helpful that
date of birth is given in the Death Index from June Q 1969 onwards.
Good point.
Post by Jenny M Benson
Again, might not be strictly accurate.
It's only as accurate as the informant knew, I think!
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"Dook, that was great but I think the line needs
awe. Can you do it again, giving it just a little awe?"

"Sure, George," said Wayne and looking up at the cross said:
"Aw, truly this man is the son of God."
(recounted in Radio Times, 30 March-5 April 2013.)
Chris Pitt Lewis
2019-04-19 17:07:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
 And the 1939 Register has exact birth dates so is very useful
confirming  info if you can find your cousins on it.  Electoral rolls
also help to  confirm a family if the children stay at home once they
have reached  voting age.
Exact, but not always totally accurate!  On several occasions I have
found the year to be a little out, though the day and month are
usually right and the correct year can be verified from the GRO Index.
+1! I can only assume the questionnaire asked for age rather than date,
or something like that; it's often out by 1 year (with, as you say, day
and month being correct).
I expect the question asked for "date of birth", but people will have
been asked for it far less often than they are nowadays, so the thought
process may have gone something like: "Well, my birthday is 22 December
but what year? I'm 52 now so it must be..." followed by a failure of
mental arithmetic.

And there are always some people who, deliberately or not, are rather
vague about their age.

It is also important to check the original image of the 1939 register,
not just the transcription, which is not always correct.
--
Chris Pitt Lewis
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2019-04-19 21:52:52 UTC
Permalink
In message <q9cv9e$1pd$***@dont-email.me>, Chris Pitt Lewis
<***@cjpl.co.uk> writes:
[]
Post by Chris Pitt Lewis
It is also important to check the original image of the 1939 register,
not just the transcription, which is not always correct.
And any other document for which the original is available! Though it
costs more to do so if you've only gone for pay-per-view access
(generally a very bad idea). PPV is all that's available for Scottish
records, sadly - not sure if _those_ cost more for original images.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The early worm gets the bird.
MB
2019-04-21 07:52:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
And any other document for which the original is available! Though it
costs more to do so if you've only gone for pay-per-view access
(generally a very bad idea). PPV is all that's available for Scottish
records, sadly - not sure if _those_ cost more for original images.
Not in Scotland, in many parts of Scotland you can pay £15 at the local
archive and get a day's unlimited access to ScotlandsPeople.
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2019-04-21 14:19:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by MB
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
And any other document for which the original is available! Though it
costs more to do so if you've only gone for pay-per-view access
(generally a very bad idea). PPV is all that's available for Scottish
records, sadly - not sure if _those_ cost more for original images.
Not in Scotland, in many parts of Scotland you can pay £15 at the local
archive and get a day's unlimited access to ScotlandsPeople.
Useful to know, thanks. Though I was thinking about online-from-home.
(Also, I'm in Kent ...)

John
--


Petitions are still unfair.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/232770 255soft.uk #fairpetitions
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

After all is said and done, usually more is said.
MB
2019-04-21 15:27:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Useful to know, thanks. Though I was thinking about online-from-home.
(Also, I'm in Kent ...)
You can get a some information by searching the ScotlandsPeople index
(free) which effectively gives you similar information to what you can
get from the England and Wales BMD index.
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2019-04-21 23:53:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by MB
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Useful to know, thanks. Though I was thinking about online-from-home.
(Also, I'm in Kent ...)
You can get a some information by searching the ScotlandsPeople index
(free) which effectively gives you similar information to what you can
get from the England and Wales BMD index.
Thanks.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Intelligence isn't complete without the full picture and the full picture is
all about doubt. Otherwise, you go the way of George Bush. - baroness Eliza
Manningham-Buller (former head of MI5), Radio Times 3-9 September 2011.
Athel Cornish-Bowden
2019-04-19 17:07:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter
I am attempting to research my grand-father's family of wife and seven
children, all of whom are dead.
I am a newcome to family research.
The cost of proving date of birth is that of £11 for a birth
certificate.
Is there any way of reducing or avoiding this fee?
The way it worked with my maternal grandmother probably wouldn't work
for you, but here it is, anyway. I knew she was born in County Derry,
but I didn't have the exact place or date. (My mother didn't get on
with her mother, and knew next to nothing about her origins.) I applied
to the proper authorities for a birth certificate, but there was some
delay (for reasons I don't remember) in getting their reply to me
telling me how much to pay, and by that time the short deadline for
paying had expired. However, the reply already told me what I wanted to
know, so I decided I could live without a certificate.
--
athel
MB
2019-04-19 17:20:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Athel Cornish-Bowden
The way it worked with my maternal grandmother probably wouldn't work
for you, but here it is, anyway. I knew she was born in County Derry,
but I didn't have the exact place or date. (My mother didn't get on with
her mother, and knew next to nothing about her origins.) I applied to
the proper authorities for a birth certificate, but there was some delay
(for reasons I don't remember) in getting their reply to me telling me
how much to pay, and by that time the short deadline for paying had
expired. However, the reply already told me what I wanted to know, so I
decided I could live without a certificate.
When I first started out there was really only the IGI online and 1881
Census on CD-ROM. So I had to travel to the other side of the country
to get access to the BMD indexes then sent off for my certificates. At
that time I ordered from the local offices and several times they were
quite helpful and told me that a particular on was not the one I needed.

i spent about £200 getting the 1891 census on fiche for my home town.

There is a lot that can be found free online and some libraries give
access to some of the commercial sites.

There are quite a number of newspaper archives available free through
libraries so you can often find things in Hatch. Match and Despatch columns.

See if there is local Family History Society, you might get help and
tips there.

Search online, always a possibility someone has researched the family
though obviously check the information is accurate.
Steve Hayes
2019-04-22 00:27:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter
I am attempting to research my grand-father's family of wife and seven
children, all of whom are dead.
I am a newcome to family research.
The cost of proving date of birth is that of £11 for a birth
certificate.
Is there any way of reducing or avoiding this fee? The arithmetic with
seven children is simple, but beyond my pocket.
It is worth getting a certificate for direct ancestors, but you can
try to find their siblings by other means.

The FreeBMD index allows you to search for births of people accurate
to within 3 months, and a rough indication of place. But it is better
to use this method when you are more experienced, especially if you
are dealing with common surnames. As you become more experieced, you
get a "feel" for things -- if children are born in different places,
for example, how close are they, or how likely is it that the family
moved there?

Try FamilySearch. It's free, and you may find that someone else has
been researching your family. But take all such information with
caution, and check it out for yourself.
--
Steve Hayes
Web: http://hayesgreene.wordpress.com/
http://hayesgreene.blogspot.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/afgen/
MB
2019-04-22 07:37:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Hayes
It is worth getting a certificate for direct ancestors, but you can
try to find their siblings by other means.
The FreeBMD index allows you to search for births of people accurate
to within 3 months, and a rough indication of place. But it is better
to use this method when you are more experienced, especially if you
are dealing with common surnames. As you become more experieced, you
get a "feel" for things -- if children are born in different places,
for example, how close are they, or how likely is it that the family
moved there?
Try FamilySearch. It's free, and you may find that someone else has
been researching your family. But take all such information with
caution, and check it out for yourself.
Some areas have sites like LancashireBMD which uses local records so
will give more information on the location than the BMD Index.

Also there are sites like Online Parish Clerk which have church records
and tend to be more accurate and detailed than familysearch.org
Jenny M Benson
2019-04-22 13:39:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Hayes
Try FamilySearch. It's free, and you may find that someone else has
been researching your family. But take all such information with
caution, and check it out for yourself.
Good advuce, but don't forget that there are two parts to FamilySearch.
The main menu offers you FamilyTree, where you might well be able to
find several generations of a family but much of the information might
be submitted by other users without naming Sources, and Search. The
Search button provides another menu which starts with Records. On the
whole, Records are reliable BUT are very often only transcripts of the
original documents and transcripts may or may not be accurate. There
are, though, original images for many of the datasets.
--
Jenny M Benson
http://jennygenes.blogspot.co.uk/
Keith Nuttle
2019-04-22 14:38:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jenny M Benson
Post by Steve Hayes
Try FamilySearch. It's free, and you may find that someone else has
been researching your family. But take all such information with
caution, and check it out for yourself.
Good advuce, but don't forget that there are two parts to FamilySearch.
The main menu offers you FamilyTree, where you might well be able to
find several generations of a family but much of the information might
be submitted by other users without naming Sources, and Search.  The
Search button provides another menu which starts with Records.  On the
whole, Records are reliable BUT are very often only transcripts of the
original documents and transcripts may or may not be accurate.  There
are, though, original images for many of the datasets.
There is a third part of FamilySearch. That is the local records.
While some of these local records appear in the primary search from
FamilySearch.org, the best are usually only found by using the native
indexes in the documents themselves.

https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/list

Personally most of my work is with the local records, I very rarely do
searches from primary FamilySearch page, and almost never use the trees.
--
2018: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre
Tickettyboo
2019-04-24 20:30:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter
I am attempting to research my grand-father's family of wife and seven
children, all of whom are dead.
I am a newcome to family research.
The cost of proving date of birth is that of £11 for a birth
certificate.
Is there any way of reducing or avoiding this fee? The arithmetic with
seven children is simple, but beyond my pocket.
Petefj
No one seems to have mentioned LDS Family History Centres. The recent
(and ongoing) plan of the LDS is to digitise all their holdings, that
were previously on microfilm. Where the agreement with the record
holders permits, they are accessible by non church members (such as
myself) from home. Where the agreement doesn't permit that if you can
visit an FHC they will happily allow you to use the centres computers
to view the records.
I have visited FHCS in many different places on different continents,
Despite some people's perceptions I have NEVER come across any attempt
to convert me, on the contrary, I have just met with friendly people
who are happy to help.
https://www.familysearch.org/locations/
Its saved me a fortune in travelling to various archives to find what I
am looking for, or ordering copies of records from remote archives..

Well worth thinking about.
--
Tickettyboo
Keith Nuttle
2019-04-25 11:26:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tickettyboo
Post by Peter
I am attempting to research my grand-father's family of wife and seven
children, all of whom are dead.
I  am a newcome to family research.
The cost of proving date of birth is that of £11 for a birth
certificate.
Is there any way of reducing or avoiding this fee?  The arithmetic with
seven children is simple, but beyond my pocket.
Petefj
No one seems to have mentioned LDS Family History Centres. The recent
(and ongoing) plan of the LDS is to digitise all their holdings, that
were previously on microfilm. Where the agreement with the record
holders permits, they are accessible by non church members (such as
myself) from home. Where the agreement doesn't permit that if you can
visit an FHC they will happily allow you to use the centres computers to
view the records.
I have visited FHCS in many different places on different continents,
Despite some people's perceptions I have NEVER come across any attempt
to convert me, on the contrary, I have just met with friendly people who
are happy to help.
https://www.familysearch.org/locations/
Its saved me a fortune in travelling to various archives to find what I
am looking for, or ordering copies of records from remote archives..
Well worth thinking about.
This is my experience also. While I am not part of the LDS, I admire
the work they have done to make these records available.

While Ancestry has added some document images only, I still do most of
my research on he LSD site.

If you have not worked with the local records you are missing a lot
--
2018: The year we learn to play the great game of Euchre
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