Partingale surname

[Jenny M Benson]

Does anyone know if the surname Partingale is one of those delightfully
idiosyncratic names that are designed to trap the unwary? (Like
Mainwaring, Cholmondeley, Happisburgh, etc.)

I came across mention in a Will of someone named as Maria Partingale. I
have found her in a Census as Partingale, but it has been "corrected" by
a user to Portnell. I have also found the Marriage Register entry
where her husband and the vicar have written his surname as Portnell.

It wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that Partingale is correctly
pronounced Portnell.

[unknown]

+ User FidoNet address: 1:124/5016

Post by Jenny M Benson
Does anyone know if the surname Partingale is one of those delightfully
idiosyncratic names that are designed to trap the unwary? (Like
Mainwaring, Cholmondeley, Happisburgh, etc.)
I came across mention in a Will of someone named as Maria Partingale. I
have found her in a Census as Partingale, but it has been "corrected" by
a user to Portnell. I have also found the Marriage Register entry
where her husband and the vicar have written his surname as Portnell.
It wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that Partingale is correctly
pronounced Portnell.

This message only just showed up here. That may explain the lack of success
you've had, as you mention in the Google group.

Also, according to Google, there are plenty of references to the name
Partingale. Maybe the person who submitted the correction was mistaken?
--
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ The FidoNet News Gate (Huntsville, AL - USA) +
+ The views of this user are strictly his or her own. +
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[Ian Goddard]

Post by unknown
+ User FidoNet address: 1:124/5016
This message only just showed up here. That may explain the lack of success
you've had, as you mention in the Google group.
Also, according to Google, there are plenty of references to the name
Partingale. Maybe the person who submitted the correction was mistaken?
--
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+ The FidoNet News Gate (Huntsville, AL - USA) +
+ The views of this user are strictly his or her own. +
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Nigel,

It showed up on my ISP's feed, which is essentially Giganews, so maybe
the delay you're seeing is the FidoNet gateway's.

Ian

[john]

Post by Jenny M Benson
Does anyone know if the surname Partingale is one of those delightfully
idiosyncratic names that are designed to trap the unwary?  (Like
Mainwaring, Cholmondeley, Happisburgh, etc.)
I came across mention in a Will of someone named as Maria Partingale.  I
have found her in a Census as Partingale, but it has been "corrected" by
a user to  Portnell.  I have also found the Marriage Register entry
where her husband and the vicar have written his surname as Portnell.
It wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that Partingale is correctly
pronounced Portnell.

Perhaps Partingale is another variation of Portingale?

from https://tinyurl.com/ybaxls2c
Portingale Spelling Variations
Spelling variations of this family name include: Petingale, Pettengill,
Pettingale, Pettengill, Pettingall, Petnal, Pettnall, Pettnel,
Pettinell, Pettinall, Pettengell and many more.
and also https://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Portingale

In the 1881 census it is very rare
https://britishsurnames.co.uk/surname/partingale/
As are Portnell https://britishsurnames.co.uk/surname/portnell/stats
and Portingale https://britishsurnames.co.uk/surname/portingale/stats

You could explore links in
https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/England_Personal_Names

[Jenny M Benson]

Post by john
from https://tinyurl.com/ybaxls2c
Portingale Spelling Variations
Spelling variations of this family name include: Petingale, Pettengill,
Pettingale, Pettengill, Pettingall, Petnal, Pettnall, Pettnel,
Pettinell, Pettinall, Pettengell and many more.
and also https://www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Portingale

I've looked at the Will again and it is definitely spelled Partingale or
Partingall there, but that doesn't mean it wasn't spelled with an o
elsewhere. I'm more than ever convinced that Portnell was the (local)
pronunciation of the "correct" Partingale or Portingale.

Post by john
In the 1881 census it is very rare
https://britishsurnames.co.uk/surname/partingale/
As are Portnell https://britishsurnames.co.uk/surname/portnell/stats
and Portingale https://britishsurnames.co.uk/surname/portingale/stats
You could explore links in
https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/England_Personal_Names

Thank you, there's some interesting stuff there.

One of these days I'm going to find the time (I wish!) to check my tree
to see how often the "usual British naming convention" was followed.

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

On Sat, 6 Mar 2021 at 13:10:56, Jenny M Benson <***@hotmail.co.uk>
wrote (my responses usually follow points raised):
[]

Post by Jenny M Benson
One of these days I'm going to find the time (I wish!) to check my tree
to see how often the "usual British naming convention" was followed.

By "uBnc", do you mean just the "took husband's surname" (and children
did too) convention, or are you referring to something else, like the
Partingale/Portnell thing?
(FWIW, I don't think I have _anyone_ in my tree that doesn't use
patriarchal surnames, apart from illegitimate births, or where people
with the same surname married [so you can't tell anyway, or a _few_ from
late 20th century on [but even then, it's rare].)

[john]

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
[]

Post by Jenny M Benson
One of these days I'm going to find the time (I wish!) to check my tree
to see how often the "usual British naming convention" was followed.

By "uBnc", do you mean just the "took husband's surname" (and children
did too) convention, or are you referring to something else, like the
Partingale/Portnell thing?
(FWIW, I don't think I have _anyone_ in my tree that doesn't use
patriarchal surnames, apart from illegitimate births, or where people
with the same surname married [so you can't tell anyway, or a _few_ from
late 20th century on [but even then, it's rare].)

From one section (Naming Pattern) of the link I gave earlier
https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/England_Personal_Names#Naming_Pattern

the usual British naming convention was as follows:

• The first son was named after the paternal grandfather
• The second son was named after the maternal grandfather
• The third son was named after the father
• The fourth son was named after the oldest paternal uncle
• The fifth was named after the second oldest paternal uncle or the
oldest maternal uncle

• The first daughter was named after the maternal grandmother
• The second daughter was named after the paternal grandmother
• The third daughter was named after the mother
• The fourth daughter was named after the oldest maternal aunt
• The fifth was named after the second oldest maternal aunt or the
oldest paternal aunt

If there was duplication (for example, the paternal grandfather and the
father had the same name), then the family moved to the next position on
the list.

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

[]

Post by john

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
By "uBnc", do you mean just the "took husband's surname" (and
children did too) convention, or are you referring to something else,
like the Partingale/Portnell thing?

[]

Post by john
From one section (Naming Pattern) of the link I gave earlier
https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/England_Personal_Names#Naming_Patte
rn

Thanks for this; I'd never come across it. I wonder how widely-known it
was.

Post by john
• The first son was named after the paternal grandfather
• The second son was named after the maternal grandfather
• The third son was named after the father
• The fourth son was named after the oldest paternal uncle
• The fifth was named after the second oldest paternal uncle or the
oldest maternal uncle
• The first daughter was named after the maternal grandmother
• The second daughter was named after the paternal grandmother
• The third daughter was named after the mother
• The fourth daughter was named after the oldest maternal aunt
• The fifth was named after the second oldest maternal aunt or the
oldest paternal aunt
If there was duplication (for example, the paternal grandfather and the
father had the same name), then the family moved to the next position
on the list.

[Jenny M Benson]

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Thanks for this; I'd never come across it. I wonder how widely-known it
was.

I've come across frequent mention of this "British naming convention"
but have always been a bit sceptical about it. I think I might have
heard that it's more common in Scotland - or that a slightly different
version is/was practised in Scotland. (But I could be mis-remembering.)

[J. P. Gilliver (John)]

Post by Jenny M Benson

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Thanks for this; I'd never come across it. I wonder how widely-known
it was.

I've come across frequent mention of this "British naming convention"
but have always been a bit sceptical about it. I think I might have
heard that it's more common in Scotland - or that a slightly different
version is/was practised in Scotland. (But I could be mis-remembering.)

Come to think of it, the "name after grandfather" part could explain the
alternating forenames (Ralph/William Weightman) in one of my lines.

[Charles Ellson]

On Sat, 6 Mar 2021 21:34:26 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)

Post by Jenny M Benson

Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Thanks for this; I'd never come across it. I wonder how widely-known
it was.

I've come across frequent mention of this "British naming convention"
but have always been a bit sceptical about it. I think I might have
heard that it's more common in Scotland - or that a slightly different
version is/was practised in Scotland. (But I could be mis-remembering.)

Come to think of it, the "name after grandfather" part could explain the
alternating forenames (Ralph/William Weightman) in one of my lines.

IME the pattern is mostly Scottish. I have encountered it on a more
localised basis in parts of England (e.g. Ripley in Derbyshire) which
there could possibly be the consequence of either or both of
immigrating miners/ironworkers or ministers of local non-conformist
churches.